Wynne’s wind fiasco

1297438693754_ORIGINALWebsite explains the real story of electricity generation in Ontario
By Lorrie Goldstein, Toronto Sun
There’s a simple way to understand the real story of electricity generation in Ontario — as opposed to the bafflegab coming from Premier Kathleen Wynne and the Liberals.

Go to www.ieso.ca, the website of the Independent Electricity System Operator, and look at the graphs at the right hand side of the page marked “Energy Demand” and, below that, “Generation By Fuel Type.” From that, you’ll learn three things Wynne and Co. are loathe to tell you about electricity generation in Ontario.

1. Nuclear power is the backbone of our system and will be for generations to come.
2. Contrary to their claims, the Liberals aren’t replacing coal power with wind, but with natural gas.
3. Wind power, despite its massive cost and the fury it has ignited in rural Ontario because of the dictatorial way the Liberals imposed it, actually supplies an inconsequential amount of electricity. (Solar is even smaller.)  Read article

47 thoughts on “Wynne’s wind fiasco

  1. Why doesn’t this information get spread all over the MSM instead of the lies being spread by the Wind Pushers, (for their own financial gain, at our expense!!!)

  2. Yes in the breaking news department this ranks with Sun rose this morning in the east. Why is this basic factual knowledge about GEA and wind energy being reported just now?

  3. Lorrie Goldstein – is absolutely right –
    the Liberals are Idiots…………
    and, only an idiot – would follow
    a Liberal – to green hell.

    ‘[excerpt] But what the Liberals have done is waste billions of dollars of our money on the useless boondoggle of wind, when they could have achieved the same environmental results through the use of nuclear power and natural gas, which is what they’re really doing anyway. Idiots.’

    • This is also about political power which the ENGOs were able to get by being involved in renewable energy.
      Take a look at Europe and the U.S. where these groups wield tremendous political power to get what they want including money. Anyone that stands against them is sued or threatned in some way.
      And it’s not known for sure just how much power these groups have gotten hold here.

      • Some of these groups have turned into nothing more than shake-down artists.

  4. They are worse than idiots. They are willfully ignorant, they know the harm they are doing, but choose to ignore it, because of the almighty dollar. The “green” that they are always going on about, is money. Wind turbines are destructive to the environment, and everything in it.

  5. Solve the problem of breaking into the BIG newspapers with the truth. Impossible as that may remain, efforts must stay the course until the BIG papers grow some balls and start reporting
    the fiasco called ‘green energy.

    • That is a great chart Ron. Easily demonstrates how completely useless wind is in the energy supply mix. So when we multiply the number of existing turbines by say five, instead of contributing 2% it will contribute 10%. Maybe. Right now we have a good breeze but that could change at any minute. And look at coal. How again is wind replacing it? The Toronto liberal party are dumb liars. They need to go immediately before the f things up any more than they have.

      • Wasn’t the origianal plan for 10%? And when they get 10% promoters will push for more and more. There will never be enough.

      • I think 650,000 will replace the real power we already have,all we need….which begs the question “why are we building ANY?

      • Anita,
        Glad you like it. I forgot to mention that the 48-hour charts is very revealing. If you look at it occasionally over a period of time, it shows very clearly that wind is seldom available when it could displace some coal, and when it is available it usually displaces emission-free Nuclear and Hydraulic.
        It is very clear that wind Power in Ontario provides essentially no benefit to Air Quality and Environment.

    • This is a dramatic presentation and supplements the basic data from the right sidebar here. What envio types never admit is that 84% of energy is being generated today from clean, green sources! Wind turbines are the answer to exactly what problem?
      European countries strain to achieve even 20% clean energy.

    • One obvious thing jumps out at me when looking at the line graph:
      Why is Hydro not a flat line like nuclear? Spilling its dams to make room for wind. What a farce! Such a shame. Wind proponents are fraudsters, plain and simple.

  6. The Telegraph, July 6, 2013
    “Our lights will stay on – but it will cost us a fortune”
    Need 60 GW to replace the coal & nuclear.
    Diesel generation
    CHP (Combined heat and power)
    Re-start gas fired power stations
    Now power costs 50 pounds/MWh
    100 pounds/MWh for onshore
    150 pounds/MWH for offshore
    It’s easy to see who will get rich from this situation.
    Diesel fumes in foggy London. People will get what they voted for.

    • BloombergBusinessweek, June 28, 2013
      “Arkansas wind turbine plant to stop production”
      Nordex SE has not received enough orders combined with overcapacity in the industry and an unstable outlook for the PTC to keep the plant open.
      Turbines will now come from Germany.
      This plant opened in 2010.
      Arkansas dosen’t have enough constant wind for much IWT development.

      • Reuters, Nordex SE (NDXG.DE)
        Closed Oct.1, 2007 at Euro 35.48/shr
        Closed July 1, 2013 at Euro 5.11/shr
        The manufacturing IWT overcapacity around the world is all over the internet.
        It would be most unlikely that Ontario could establish IWT manufacturing. Yet Ontarians continue to be mislead about this situation.
        No jobs will be created here from IWT manufacturing.

      • For anyone to mislead those who live in the Niagara region or anywhere else in Ontario that there will be renewable enrgy manufacturing jobs is flat out wrong!

      • Maybe we can ask the Chamber of Commerce?
        There’s a topic!

      • This is a good place to start! Since 2009 the solar manufacturing industry is in a shambles and wind is not far behind.
        If you look at the long term stock price charts for wind and solar you can see that 2007-2008 were the highs and by 2009 the prices started down. Didn’t anyone see this starting to happen back in 2009? These are/ were good indicators that something was wrong.
        Maybe they thought this was due to the 2008 financial crash but it wasn’t. Due to overcapacity in these industries for one thing.

      • Another topic of interest – Enbridge – and their energy partners.
        According to some – securing land – for up to –
        50 and, even 60 years –
        is a huge success for Enbridge – and partners.

        So who get’s to eat real food?
        Climate Change – an opportunity……………
        Cha Ching! [repeat]

        Maybe – it’s about ‘gas’ only.
        Just maybe!

      • Do you want to see something cool?
        No pressure!
        What came first?
        The chicken – or the egg?
        Who get’s the last laugh?

        Securing land – it’s a miracle!

  7. Exactly right Barbara, but it goes back to the very beginning of the McGuinty scam.
    McGuinty could have closed all the coal plants he promised to by 2007. His policies had already decimated any industrial manufacturing industry in Ontario and energy demand had already declined enough for him to close the remaining coal plants.
    But remaining true to being possibly one of the most hypocritical, dishonest and most crooked politicians in recent history(Wynne may yet out do him), he already knew what a scam wind energy would be and needed the coal plants to back up the new wind energy scam he was about to deliberately inflict on rural Ontario.
    Sad thing is that closing down all the coal plants still leaves us with ‘natural’ gas as the new and cheap ‘clean’ energy to back up wind! ‘Natural’ gas? Just like ‘natural’ coal! It’s a fossil fuel with emissions potentially every bit as harmful as coal. No one actually knows just what fracking may do to our environment over time yet we still see coal as only bad and natural gas as only good?
    As for Niagara? Unfortunately we have Regional Council who may as well be employees of the regions largest wind energy company. Rankin ‘owns’ Niagara Region and is the biggest corporate welfare recipient in the region. The recent support for Wainfleet and West Lincoln claiming they were unwilling hosts was pure political opportunism, an easy way and good PR to pretend to be listening to the ordinary folk they are supposed to represent.
    If anyone reading this post actually believes that this Regional Council will ever give a majority vote against any wind energy project Rankin wants to do you will be sadly disappointed. They still have a $9,000,000, 7 year old contract with Rankin, for a wind project that failed. They have publicly stated they have taken it off the shelf, dusted it off and whatever Rankin wants they will resurrected this redundant contract to make sure the tax subsidized profits he was counting on 7 years ago will still end up in his bank account.
    Niagara Region still believe that McGuinty was right. And after all, Rankin is god!
    Andrew Watts

    • Do enough people in the Niagara region know that it is not possible to establish wind and solar manufacturing in Ontario and that they have been sold a bill of goods?
      Maybe copying some of the information on these issues from the internet to show people will make an impression on them.
      The Ontario MSM either dosen’t know about these issues or prefers to hide them from the public.
      Would it be cheaper to just pay the $9 million and drop the contract?
      These IWTs will cost the public a lot more than $9 M in the end.

      • Sooner the cheaper on all cancer wind and solar……save the building cost And all the 20 year giveaway for the power we don’t need anyway……

      • The long term stock price charts for renewable energy, wind & solar, stocks have what looks like speculative price bubbles rather than long term values.

  8. The NEW green energy: Gas and Diesel generators
    A Demand Response program pays those who own backup generators to use them and go off the grid when Ontario is short of electricity.

    Many Ontario farms have backup generators in case of an electricity outage. Some farms may be eligible to be paid to use their generators to go off the electrical grid when Ontario’s generating capacity is stressed due to spikes in demand or shortages in supply. The technical term is ‘Demand Response’. By switching to backup generation when the grid needs additional energy supply, demand response participants reduce the overall demand for electricity.

    Farmers may be eligible to participate if they have a sufficiently large generator and an internet connection. Only generators that are not exporting electricity to the grid are allowed to participate in demand response programs.

    Farmers could receive a payment for being on-call, plus additional payments each time they are dispatched to provide grid relief.

    • Give yourself a gift – securing your future.
      Focus on the ‘good-times’.

      Marion Fraser, Fraser & Company

      Marion Fraser is considered one of the foremost practitioners of sustainable energy policy and programs in Ontario. With 28 years of experience in the energy sector, she pioneered demand side management programs at Ontario Hydro contributing to saving over 1200 MW of electricity from 1989 to 1993. She applied this experience to an active consulting practice until she was recruited to head Enbridge Gas Distribution’s demand side management efforts where she spearheaded programs saving customers $700 million over three years and delivering a shareholder incentive of $13 million under an innovative regulatory framework which she helped establish.

      When the McGuinty government was elected in 2003, although she had not been active politically, it hired Marion to ensure that sustainability was a key element in energy policy.

      Marion is a visionary leader who has had great success in building results oriented teams as well as innovative partnerships across multiple organizations engaging people in private and public sector organizations as well as non governmental agencies.


      What is a farmer – in Ontario?
      Getting involved – a little foggy?
      Are the incentives there?

      The beauty of the situation – still to unfold.

    • I posted last week about the number of diesel backup generators in major institutions, industries, homes and farms in Ont, rural and urban, A major blackout in Toronto would see scores of diesel units kick in after a few minutes, No rural home in the ice storm region is without a generator now, knowing the delivery system cannot be guaranteed.
      Are the emissions from these gas and diesel units ever figured into the alleged reduction in Co2 output? Has Wynne and company ever thought about it? I doubt it very much but they would have to be substantial. .

      • The politicians have figured out that they have to have a backup plan in case of a major power failure that’s not weather related.
        Diesel does help to fill in this potential gap.
        This is not about CO2. This is about money with CO2 furnishing the excuse for wind and solar projects.
        Demand side management is an old dictator’s tool used to control people. Fits in fine with Agenda 21 and Greenpeace.
        As for anyone in Ontario claiming to have “invented” this it is B.S.

      • Reuters, Oct.,5, 2012
        “Cold, Calm and Cloudy May Mean Power Cuts for Western Europe”
        Short explanation of the power problems in Western Europe.
        Rural Ontarians need to know what Europe’s power problems are because they are being told that there is nothing wrong with the European power supplies.
        Now France has cut back on their power supply to their citizens.as of July 1, 2013.

    • Hey Martin,
      You must be talking about the – Co2 – ‘financial crisis’
      It’s so gracious of the Liberal government –
      but, sometimes they can be a let down.

      Wynne battles for ‘social justice’; and, it’s hard to judge the landing.
      One thing is for sure – it’s a communist plan.

      A huge power grab – and, who get’s the top prize?

  9. Life does not stop –
    because Bob Chiarelli – is not really into energy;
    and chooses not to connect with the rising costs;
    and, the debate gets tough – on how Ontario citizens
    are being scammed by the Ontario Power Authority.

    Big deal – Chiarelli – has a twitter account.

    Real issues – Chiarelli – loves;
    as long as the pay cheque – arrives on time.

  10. Health effects of wind turbine noise known since 1987: “November 1987 report prepared for the US Department of Energy said the impact of low-frequency noise generated by wind turbines was often “confined to within surrounding homes” and that residents became more sensitive to the impact over time.
    The laboratory experiments found that “people do indeed react to a low-frequency noise environment”.
    The study, A Proposed Metric for Assessing the Potential of Community Annoyance from Wind Turbine Low-Frequency Noise Emissions, was prepared in response to earlier research into “acoustic disturbances” associated with the operation of a wind turbine near Boone, North Carolina.”

  11. http://www.ieso.ca/imoweb/media/md_supply.asp
    This ieso site says we have 1560 MW of installed wind power. However adding up the MW of wind power given on the site that Ron Hartlen pointed out it appears Ontario really has about 1636 MW of installed wind power. So that instead of producing at 7.5% of installed capacity it is really producing 7.1% . Even more pathetic. However right now nuclear is working at 83.5% of its 12,998 MW of installed capacity. If wind would work as efficiently as nuclear it would be producing 1432 MW not the 117 MW that it is at this hour. Just some mathletics and coffee to jumpstart the day! Just went to check my numbers and wind is now producing 70 MW of power in Ontario. So instead of providing 1% of power to our grid it is now listed at 0%. I feel like kicking something.

    • The Ontario Power Bureaucracy – ought to consider;
      ‘clarifying expectations’ – for the long term.
      But – the design of the agency – is to work in secrecy;
      and shred – shred – shred.

      But – that was McGuinty’s agreement.

  12. Sorry that would be 1366 MW of wind not 1432 MW if it were to be working as efficiently as nuclear. We have enough liars here in Ontario as it is.

  13. https://demanda.ree.es/demandaGeneracionAreasEng.html
    Looking at this chart you’re probably thinking wind doesn’t look too bad in Spain. Yah it is producing about 4,0000 MW at this time or 11.4% of 35,717 MW of demand. But they have 22,796 MW installed. Spain must look like a pincushion. Nuclear is producing about 70000 MW. But they have 7560 installed. Looks like they rely on coal quite abit. Germany must be learning from them with their 23 new coal plants. Better not shut down Nanticoke quite yet.

    • The sooner one of these countries’ grids fails the better off the whole world will be as this scam will be exposed for what it really is. Just hope it won’t be in winter for the poor to have to bear the brunt of this.

    • Anita! You didn’t refer to Denmark…??? 🙂
      I must admit that the envirofreaks have stopped using it as their Poster Child as they always used to.
      I think you will find that over 30 years of ‘planet saving’ wind energy Denmark still relies on coal for 80% of its energy needs!
      Every study, every report, even government reports from places who still support green energy, shows quite clearly that wind(and solar) energy only has negative economical, environmental and societal impacts and cannot deliver on a single promise the industries have been making for decades now.
      Our problem is we haven’t yet worked out how to stop our governments acting illegally and criminally. Most law abiding citizens don’t really know how to do that, including most of us.
      Andrew Watts

  14. Wind Energy in Ontario:
    Current installed wind energy capacity: 2,043 MW
    Number of wind farms: 46
    Number of wind turbines: 1,103
    Current per cent of Ontario’s electricity demand met by wind: 4 per cent
    Equivalent number of Ontario homes powered by wind: over 720,000

    This I found interesting as well. On the CANWEA website from spring 2013 they have 2043 MW installed reported and the IESO site 1560 MW. I sent an email a while back to the IESO as to why there was this discrepancy and this is their reply. It’s a plausible explanation I suppose.

    Thank you for the e-mail. I am not sure which page you are looking at – perhaps the IESO’s Wind Power in Ontario page at http://www.ieso.ca/imoweb/marketdata/windpower.asp. You will notice that the first chart provides the installed wind capacity in Ontario. These wind farms are currently operational in the Ontario market. The chart below it provides wind projects that are scheduled to come in service by Spring 2014. As they become in service, they will be moved to the first chart.

    I also wanted to note that the IESO only reports on wind farms that are directly connected to the IESO-controlled grid with a maximum output capability of 20 MW or greater. There are many other wind farms in Ontario, but their output and capability is not reported on the IESO website as they are not directly connected, rather they provide energy through the local distribution company.

    I hope this provides further explanation.

    Thank you,

    And yes this scam needs to be exposed. To many of us it is already a done deal and cannot imagine it going on much longer.

  15. it’s interesting to follow the power outage situation in Toronto. Maybe this might make some in the GTA start thinking about Ontario’s power supplies?
    More storms for this area are being predicted.
    So southern Ontario does not get severe weather that knocks out power lines?

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