Reviewing Ontario’s Long-Term Energy “Plan”

A GOOD time to PROTEST Ministry of Energy!!! ( 7-9pm)
Ministry of Energy
A formal review of Ontario’s Long-Term Energy Plan is currently underway. A discussion guide, Making Choices: Reviewing Ontario’s Long-term Energy Plan is available on the Environmental Registry. We would like to hear your feedback.  The Ministry of Energy is consulting with the public, energy stakeholders, and partners across the province. There are three ways to provide feedback:

  1. Please take our short online survey
  2. Provide a formal submission through the Environmental Registry
  3. Visit one of the following public open houses between 7pm and 9pm:
July 22 St. Catharines Holiday Inn Hotel & Suites St. Catharines Conference Centre
327 Ontario St. MAP
July 23 London Delta London Armouries Hotel
325 Dundas Street  MAP
July 25 Windsor Holiday Inn Ambassador Bridge
1855 Huron Church Rd. MAP
July 30-31 Toronto Intercontinental Toronto Yorkville
220 Bloor Street MAP
August 7 Thunder Bay Best Western Plus Nor’Wester Hotel & Conference Centre
2080 Highway #61 MAP
August 13 Sudbury Quality Inn & Conference Centre Downtown
390 Elgin Street South MAP
August 15 Barrie Monte Carlo Inn- Barrie Suites
81 Hart Drive MAP
August 21 Ottawa Westin Ottawa
11 Colonel By Drive MAP

Learn More:

45 thoughts on “Reviewing Ontario’s Long-Term Energy “Plan”

  1. What of bunch of cow crap.
    You have ALREADY heard our FEEDBACK MINISTRY OF ENERGY.
    We don’t need your survey’s , we don’t need your formal submissions
    and we don’t need your fancy settings for open houses .
    LISTEN to the people at the ERT’s…
    LISTEN to the people at the protests…
    That’s our FEEDBACK on the Ontario long term energy plan !
    YOU ARE LIAR”S

  2. Talk about loaded questions on that survey. They don’t give you any other option OTHER than their skewed vision of how things should be.

    Like should we import power or build more of our own power generators? None of the responses give you the option of saying, “We have enough already!!!! Don’t build any more useless crap! And while you’re at it, stop wasting our money on those stupid wind turbines!!”

    They don’t give you any options like that.

    • Older people can die during heat waves from living in houses or buildings that are too well insulated. All the extra insulation does not allow houses to cool down and without air conditioning people can die.
      A lot of deaths occured in Chicago during a heat wave a few years back in apartment buildings which did not cool down even at night.

  3. Are the open houses going to be like the community info meetings held by IWT companies? ‘Cause frankly they are useless.
    How much is this dog and pony show costing the tax payers?
    Interesting to see that the meetings are all held in very urban settings.
    Rural folks are going to have to travel quite a distance to make sure their thoughts will be heard.
    Yup. Results will be skewed.
    Must be another one of Wynne’s bright ideas…

    • All windpushers operate in the same sleazy manner. It’s that damn Windweasel’s Handbook. Available in a surprising number of languages. Not a dirty trick, underhanded scheme, or fraudulent claim, they don’t know about, or haven’t tried.

  4. Is anyone going to protest these “open houses”? This would be a natural place to protest, hit your local one.

    Rather interesting that they are during the summer, when less people will be around.

  5. This Government’s Long Term Energy Plan was put into practice in May of 2009 and now it’s a complete financial and social disaster………….what’s there to discuss?

  6. I like energy planning!
    Feedback – that’s where the money is
    Speaking of power – let’s not get too emotional

    A shill or plant is a person who helps another person or organization to sell goods or services without disclosing that he or she has a close relationship with the seller. The shill pretends to have no association with the seller/group and gives onlookers the impression that he or she is an enthusiastic independent customer. The person or group that hires the shill is using crowd psychology, to encourage other onlookers or audience members (who are unaware of the set-up) to purchase the said goods or services. Shills are often employed by confidence artists. The term is also used to describe a person who is paid to help a political party or other advocacy organization to gain adherents; as with the situation of selling goods or services, the shill gives the impression of being unrelated to the group in question, and gives the impression that he or she finds merit in the ideological claims of the political party.

    Shilling is illegal in many circumstances and in many jurisdictions[1] because of the frequently fraudulent and damaging character of the shill’s actions. However, if a shill does not place uninformed parties at a risk of loss, but merely generates “buzz”, the shill’s actions may be legal. For example, a person planted in an audience to laugh and applaud when desired (see claque), or to participate in on-stage activities as a “random member of the audience”, is a type of legal shill.

    “Shill” can also be used pejoratively to describe a critic who appears either all-too-eager to heap glowing praise upon mediocre offerings, or who acts as an apologist for glaring flaws. In this sense, they would be an implicit “shill” for the industry at large, possibly because their income is tied to its prosperity.
    http://www.princeton.edu/~achaney/tmve/wiki100k/docs/Shill.html

    Hey Ontario!
    @ any rate – ‘who’ – is commenting?
    ah – huh………Hahahahahahaha

  7. Climate Common Sense, July 12, 2013
    Wind power billions at work in UK!
    “What does a multi-billion-dollar investment in wind power get you? Currently 8.5 Gigawatts of installed capacity in the UK is producing at this moment, a paltry .6 Gigwatt of ‘free power’ or 2% of demand.”
    “Of course base-load coal and nuclear is producing most of the remaining 98%”
    http://www.climatecommonsense2.com/2013/07/wind-power-billions-at-work-in-uk.html

    How can a poor country like Ireland afford to waste money on IWTs? Ireland does not have money producing natural resources to fall back on.

  8. Well, Monday night ****** and myself went to the public meeting in Windsor, it was fun. The members of the public was ourselves and a CAW rep who wants windturbines on the new bridge, picture pinwheels on bridge supports, and small turbines and solar pannels on all new buildings. Trust me they got told, they were surprised at how informed we were. We made the point that we and industry do not want to pay more for electricity, that industry can leave for cheaper rates. CAW wants to shut down nuclear. I said nuclear has never cost me a moments loss of sleep and I would pay for nuclear and he could pay for the wind.He actually knew very little, he wanted consevation programs reinstated, they already have been. He also wants workers that lose their jobs to be retrained for green jobs, LOLOL He makes $36 HR plus benefits and a good pension and he wants workers trained for $15 hr jobs, no benefitsThey talked about planning for where infastruture should go and we told them about how our county paid over $100,000 devoloping a plan for turbines and it didn’t include the area south of CTY 20 and that the turbine compant had a meeting with the county and threatened them with a OMB hearing and the county caved, and Harrow Wind went ahead. Also that Mon night our council was approving the rd agreement for another wind farm in that same area. So like I said they got an ear full.

    • Is this the same CAW guy who said there could be a tsunami in Lake Erie which could take out the nuclear power plants? And he is supposed to be a university graduate?

      • When are these dumb lickers going to stop crawling out of the woodwork?

        You would think by now, what with all the educational tools available, TV, internet, social media, etc., these dorks would have some sort of clue as to what the hell is really going on.

        Apparently not … they seem to be churning out these goofballs a mile a minute.

      • Well Gord, Kenny likes them and if you want to get ahead in the hierarchy, you better also.

      • Is it any wonder how the CAW & UAW were taken in by the CAFE standards which are backed by eco-nuts?

  9. I read the questions and options for answers in the “survey” and will NOT be filling it out! I don’t intend to help to “prop up” a “Long-Term Energy Plan” that is clearly and totally flawed from the “get go”!!

    • Go to a meeting, there won’t be many people there and it’s harder for them to control you and what you say

    • Why not present an energy plan that cuts the GTA off from the grid and that includes huge wind and solar projects backed up by diesel generation for the GTA.
      Wind turbines do come in all sizes so there should be turbines available to fit almost anywhere in the GTA.

  10. I have doctors around the world interested in my medical information. You have thrown away your most valuable resource; “gone with the wind” may I say?!
    I have lived 5 years of hell because of this green energy scam. The only thing I have, worth anything to me, is my life. Without my health and life, I have nothing. I am not Jesus Christ; I stop short of giving my life for your cause, a society lacking in ethics and values. I am not a martyr. May you find yourself another guinea pig.

  11. I think they had a (brain/green/washed)junior high school student create that on-line survey. It’s almost as dumb as some recent studies and papers I have seen.

    For example…

    We produce enough electricity to meet our needs, but in the past we had to import electricity from neighbours. Should we consider importing energy instead of building new sources of generation here?

    How about some dates? When exactly were we short of power? In the last decade we had more than sufficient capacity to meet our needs. Like who messed up that — eh?

    How about dealing with the transmission issues eh?

    Maybe a couple of electrical generation stations inside the GTA would help — Like in Oakville and Mississauga maybe — then we won’t need so many transmission corridors — and people near Toronto will quit protesting them as well.. It’s not like we’re going to waste $595 Million or nothin’ — eh?

  12. ‘[excerpt] The Ministry of Energy is consulting with the public, energy stakeholders, and partners across the province. There are three ways to provide feedback:’
    Wynne = 1 nut
    Chiarelli = 1 nut
    Answer: Are you ready? 2 nuts

    Hey, Mr. Chiarelli,
    I want a condo – in Chicago!

  13. John Kay, Financial times, July 24,2013
    “A real energy revolution needs to look beyond sound bites”
    “The orgins of britain’s impending energy crisis go back a half a century”
    “To be able to use power the UK needs to build power stations”
    “When the lights flicker, as they will, the responsibility will lie with the preoccupation of politicians withsound bites and tabloid headlines”
    http://www.johnkay.com/2013/07/24/a-real-energy-revolution-needs-us-to-look-beyond-sound-bites

    “Detroit: Greenest City in America”
    http://m4gw.com/detroit-the-greenest-city-in-america

    • Anyone who says that loss of property value can’t make a person ill is either a fool or a knave!

      • There are different reasons why property values can decline but the effects on the owners can be devastating no matter what the reason is.
        For any doctor, psychologist,or lawyer to say otherwise dosen’t know what they are talking about.

      • One thing is for sure –
        …after closing a deal – our family found out – our lawyer made mistakes in the deal
        which caused problems for us.
        Our accountant told us never rely on a lawyer – when it comes to money.
        They only interpret – law (and some do it poorly)
        They know nothing about money.

  14. Just a general comment on the effects of wind farms. Yesterday I bought a new fan. I noticed that several of the fans were specifically marketed as quiet fans. We all know some fans are noisier than others. The fan I bought seemed relatively quiet in the store, but of course there was a lot of background noise in the store too. At home, in my much quieter bedroom, it didn’t seem as quiet, but not what you’d call loud. I sleep with earplugs anyway, but I would find it difficult to sleep with the new fan’s noise without them, even on its lowest setting. And it’s a constant white-noise type of sound.

    So, my point is, if we (society) all know and accept that a simple table fan can be loud enough to be annoying and disruptive, to the point where we seek out and pay extra for quieter fans, what is so difficult about accepting that a wind turbine,which is basically a freaking GIANT fan, be loud enough to be annoying and disruptive? By several orders of magnitude? The blades on my table fan are maybe 15 cm long. A wind turbine’s blades are 60 metres, so 400 times as long. Not that blade length is a perfect measurement of sound impacts, but you get the idea: OF COURSE wind turbines are going to make LOTS of noise.

    There is already plenty of evidence that noise affects human health so to me the wind turbine debate is a waste of time. They’re bad news, we shouldn’t have them, case closed.

  15. The locations these meetings are being held will probably be the future sites subject to a blitz by wind energy companies peddling their wares.
    This survey will provides the propaganda required to determine the best way to convince landowners to lease land.
    The survey doesn’t address the legal right of wind energy to expropriate private property under the terms on the Green Energy Act.
    It will take generations to heal the damage inflicted on Ontario my Mr. McGuinty and his policies.

    • It was posted a couple of days ago that McGuinty is on his way to Harvard. Anymore information on this yet?

      • That info is a few weeks old. It was announced within days of him resigning his seat. It seems like years ago now. He has done enough damage for several life-spans.

        Harvard loves liberals.

  16. I don’t see Windsor on the list for next week, I guess the Deputy Energy Minister had his behind chewed enough last meeting, LOL

  17. yup. sheeple can keep sending in their comments. the technocrats at the Ministry of Energy, the MOE, OPA, Environmental Commissar, will give them due consideration in this so-called democracy.

    “””In 2010, James Lovelock – environmentalist and creator of the “Gaia hypothesis” – told the Guardian that we might need fascism to curb global warming:

    “We need a more authoritative world. We’ve become a sort of cheeky, egalitarian world where everyone can have their say. It’s all very well, but there are certain circumstances – a war is a typical example – where you can’t do that. You’ve got to have a few people with authority who you trust who are running it. And they should be very accountable too, of course.
    But it can’t happen in a modern democracy. This is one of the problems. What’s the alternative to democracy? There isn’t one. But even the best democracies agree that when a major war approaches, democracy must be put on hold for the time being. I have a feeling that climate change may be an issue as severe as a war. It may be necessary to put democracy on hold for a while” “””.

  18. Putting democracy on-hold is the only way to get renewable energy installed. Look at all the dummies that fall for this kind of BS.
    Many Europeans do not view democarcy the way it is viewed in North America. Its always been rule by your “betters”.
    And Europeans did not have to hack their way through the wilderness to create a country.. Our ancestors knew how to run their own affairs even though they didn’t have much formal education and did’t like being told what to do by the “mother” country.
    These are two different kinds of people quite distinct from Europeans in these political matters.

  19. Maybe I can make it to Barrie tomorrow. Always fun to whine a bit. Maybe I’ll even get to glower and scream. Could be fun….

    I’ll be disguised as a respectable person if I do make it…

  20. I shamelessly purloined this quote from WUWT — If you get a chance use it…

    Dr. Bob says:
    August 14, 2013 at 5:46 pm

    I have worked in alternative energy for 14 years. Only low cost feedstocks will ever work for any alternative to crude oil. This means coal, natural gas, and perhaps shale oil. Other energy sources are simply to diverse or they contain too little inherent energy to be used to produce any meaningful volume of fuel. It takes a ton of biomass to make 1-2 bbls of liquid hydrocarbon fuel. And the largest biomass plants will be 2000 tons/day operating 340 days a year. This amount of biomass will require harvesting roughly 100+ sq mi of arable land as a monoculture under contract for 30 years in order for any reasonable investor or organization to be willing to put half a billion dollars into that facility. In terms of cost per bbl/day, a refinery is probably less than $50K/bbl/day capacity. Biomass to hydrocarbon liquids (the only truly useful fuel) are $200,000+/bbl/day capacity.

    With biomass having about 7500 Btu/lb and coal over 11,000+, it is hard to compete with fossil fuel. If you factor in the risk of growing a crop (storms, drought, fire, etc.), and the need to have very long term off-take agreements (30 years would probably be necessary), it is no wonder that there are essentially no cellulosic ethanol or other biomass to liquids plants in commercial production. Even the plant that rely on animal fat as feed are shut down as they cannot compete.

    Biomass — wind – solar — all sold by the Tooth Fairy and the Easter Bunny to childishly gullible Flat Earther, Gaia loving, granola muching Faux Environmentalists. And you can tell them I said so!

  21. Incredible… but true
    http://joannenova.com.au/2013/08/schwarzenegger-on-deniers-strap-them-to-a-tailpipe-for-an-hour/

    Arnold Schwarzenegger uses all his best scientific reasoning to wow the crowd at the annual National Clean Energy Summit on Tuesday in Las Vegas, Nevada:

    Speaking of greenhouse gas deniers: “Strap some conservative-thinking people to a tailpipe for an hour and then they will agree it’s a pollutant!

    The Huffington Post reports

    I suggest we use the same tactics. Let’s strap some GEA advocates to the blade of a Wind Turbine — for a few hours — maybe they will get the point.

    Then — as a follow up…. How about tying them up in the living room of a house affected by Infra-Sound? HMMMM???

    Hey if these tactics are good enough for the governor of the most populous sate in the USA — and one of its greatest thinkers — then they are good enough for me!

    Rope anyone?

    • Huffington Post reference:
      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/william-bradley/national-clean-energy-sum_b_3757805.html

      chwarzenegger suggested that we focus at least as much if not more on the upside of clean energy, looking beyond the endless warnings about climate change itself to additional benefits that may be more appealing to the uninitiated.

      That means the impact of creating new industry and jobs around clean energy, not to mention the national security implications of minimizing our reliance on oil from unfriendly or unstable places on the planet. Tellingly, the armed forces, notably the U.S. Navy, developing fuel from algae, and other armed services looking to minimize vulnerable supply lines, are taking a leading role on renewables and efficiency.

      Recalling the 2010 initiative attempt to take down California’s landmark climate change program, which Schwarzenegger and an array of allies — including ex-hedge fund billionaire Tom Steyer, who followed Schwarzenegger on the program — trounced at the polls, Schwarzenegger played to an increasingly engaged crowd. “Oil and coal companies,” he declared in his trademark manner, “can not push us around. You will be terminated.

      Hey, “termination”? — that’s for me? Eh what? Ummm you mean like “killed”? Errr…. is that Green or what? Time to get out of the mining business — ‘scuse me — gotta run — fast!!

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